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Brexit 2016

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Official thread.

I will be voting to Leave Europe.

what about you?

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unless you saying that the northern ireland economy as a whole is propped up by london, but that tyrone is some kind of independent economic powerhouse??

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I never mentioned rural economy ? You brought it up. State and governments are measured on they're GDPs and the UK GDPs are broken down into regions, that can be compared. The NI economy is not propped up by London more like kept on life support. Job quality and job creation should also be compared vs North and UK

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I agree saying Londonderry in a sentence is absurd

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Pavlov should stick to geography, and what he knows.

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I.e, I wouldn't tell somebody who has his head in books about earthquakes for 10 years solid, how earthquakes work.
And wouldn't want them telling me about how the Republican Counties on the faux-border with their ideological brothers, Work.

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just have a referendum already. Simple

let's start the conversation

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Well soyuz, I skated over the rather simplistic economic analysis in the blog because it the writers attitude points to the bigger problem of having a united ireland referendum... that is that the a significant number of the unionistcommunity don't feel their culture is properly appreciated at the minute.

Attitudes like those of the writer won't really help forward the cause of making them feel welcome in the brit-free paradise he talks about.
I'm from a nationalist background and his attitude make me was to stick with the UK.

Nationalist politicians don't really work hard to win over the hearts and minds of the unionist community so they are missing an opportunity when it comes to the brexit... they know it... otherwise they'd be some pressure to push for an unification referendum

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Your argument is all over the place. Just ranting now Pav. There are unionists living in South BTW orange lodges too.

I would agree with you that politicians not doing enough to sell benefits neither are media.

Lastly your sticking with UK because because it's great and NI the same. Spot on

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Well let me sum it up for you...

comparing the economy of the north and south is a lot more complicated than comparing the GDP of NI with the GDP of Ireland including Dublin (or the average wages of the Ireland including Dublin with the average wages of NI).

Would most people living in NI expect to earning wages on par with those in average wages of ireland as a whole including dublin? or the midlands or donegal?
(table 5 in this link from the central statistics agency in the south
www.cso.ie/en/releases...
shows that the total income per person for 2014 ranges from around 19,000 euros in Donegal to 30,000 euros in Dublin. That's about £15,000 to £24,000. )

To not factor the effects of a 30 year conflict into the analysis of the economic disparities is a glaring omission.

I'm not disputing that there are unionists living in the south and orange lodges too... I'm sure there are some in the north who would be happy to live in a united ireland

but to say that brexit will push them all into wanting to join a united ireland for purely (possibly spurious) economic reasons overlooks of the fact that sections of the unionist community feel their cultural identity is being eroded in the years since the GFA. It isn't helped when the guy making that argument refers to matching his and hers rangers tracksuits in a snidey way (because as you say their kulture isn't real culture).
My original point is that attitudes like this won't really convince them of the post-brexit United Ireland case

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I had moved on from the blog think you're misrepresenting his point's also ( which was that northern unionists have much greater kinship with Scottish than English and when Scots depart UK NI will follow whether pushed or jump )

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so why are SF not pushing for Brexit if a United Ireland is on the cards here?

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because the realise/ accept the right of self determination of everyone in the north and appreciate that they can't be pushed out of the UK...

and realise that a unionist community insecure about its identity in a united ireland is a recipe for ongoing civil unrest...

Our southern comrades probably won't be too keen on the costs of integration and since much of ireland and since much of irelands economic success rests on companies banking profits made else where in ireland for tax purposes, actual jobs will be scarce on the ground ... giving idle youths more time to get busy with their unrest

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What are NI benefits of staying in UK ?

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After Brexit

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bs.twimg.com/media/Ckb...

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I have no idea... can you tell me what the post brexit UK will look like?

I also made the point a southerner sneering at people in ranger tracksuits wont persuade them that they'll be better off in ireland.

I went on to make the point that the economics on the blog is full of shit... I did not not making the argument that somehow the UK will be better once its out of europe.

Personally, if the UK leaves europe I'd be more likely to move to germany than to ireland

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RP been trying for a few weeks now but still grasp why SF aren't pushing for a leave vote.

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What figures on blog are full of shit ?

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ukandeu.ac.uk/starting...

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I didn't mention the any figure being 'wrong'. They are being used wrongly to compare apples and oranges (lol). The analysis as i have pointed out is lacking.

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Oh you mean the figures are correct but 30 year troubles not figured re. NI woeful economic figures ?

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Lol ?

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green apples and orange oranges

neglecting the impact of the conflict on the economy, the use of average wage figures ... I included it all in my little summary for you

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"because the realise/ accept the right of self determination of everyone in the north and appreciate that they can't be pushed out of the UK...

and realise that a unionist community insecure about its identity in a united ireland is a recipe for ongoing civil unrest..."

fair enough but that sounds like how SF themselves would answer the question. I don't for a second believe SF would give the unionist community a second thought if they believed a United Ireland could be delivered within this decade following Brexit.

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also it would still be down to a vote of self determination either way.

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pavlovs dog • 10 minutes ago
I didn't mention the any figure being 'wrong'. They are being used wrongly to compare apples and oranges (lol). The analysis as i have pointed out is lacking.

You come across quite arrogant possibly patronising and defo over confident in your intelligence

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You pushed me for the the responses ... I'm sorry you feel talked down to.

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Imagine me gently patting you on the head as you read that, if it helps

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All your posts on the subject were just waffle with zero substance ? And now your patting yourself on the back ? Why I have no clue. Pseudo intellectual

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Oh yeah the rangers tracksuits

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Ha at all that patronising nonsensical bullshit and then sorry if you feel talked down to.
You know rightly what you're doing and sure black is white.
Zzzz.

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lol theres that sun shining again

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This is an excellent piece that sums up the whole brexit debate
eulsterfry.com/world-n...

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so Blair and Major are threatening a United Ireland if we leave as well? all sounds a bit desparate

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-...

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its like they think they are losing the Unionist vote to the leave campaign so are rolling out the fear with this United Ireland nonsense

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So are you brexit or bremain RP?

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I am bremain.

Just because I see it as a lesser of two evils. No way I can see the likes of Gove and Boris having the interests of anyone but their inner band of tories in their thoughts.

The EU needs some proper reform though.

They way the Eurocrisis was created and who is paying for it through the solutions introduced - its disgraceful.

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Why do you automatically think that UK elections will always be dominated by the right after leaving? At least you have the opportunity to remove them.

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The EU will not reform. For those in charge it is functioning perfectly.

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I don't really, but they are driving the main campaign to leave.

Then, I see no difference between a Labour gov and Consev gov...as proven by the last 30 years.

Maybe under Corbyn Labour would be less neo-liberal, but that would just be hopeful speculation

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wundergroundmusic.com/...

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LOL at this. www.buzzfeed.com/matth...

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I got a very sneaky piece of toilet pap.. I mean literature through the post a couple of days ago designs to look *extremely* like official polling day documentation/card... yet it was clearly Brexit propaganda. I'd say it will catch a lot of people out thinking that it's 'FACTS' (in large print), really are facts.

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lol at that flotilla, Bob Geldof is the biggest wanker to ever come from Ireland.

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Dont know why anyone would vote to leave. The world is just like one big school playground with the uk hanging about with Europe making them seem hard. The uk has all of a sudden got too confident and thinks they can go on their own and just be as respected and will soon realise they are not as tough as they think they are without the EU to back them up.

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Cheer up, Sumguy. you'll soon be sent back to the sunny uk its access to chep mail order book and goods

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I say leave, mainly because i dont live there, and it means nothing to me and I just want to see what happens. Best of luck.

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lol you live in the states though, don't you? You could have Trump as President! :D

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Geldof, what a cunt

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